Current Server Time: 19:46 (Central Europe)

#apertus IRC Channel Logs

2014/01/30

Timezone: UTC


00:49
Bertl
off for a nap ... bbl
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danhanes
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[1]se6astian
changed nick to: se6astian
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16:14
Bertl
morning everyone!
16:38
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18:14
troy_s_
Bertl: Greets
18:14
troy_s_
se6astian: Interesting document.
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20:27
guesst
what document?
20:39
SashaC
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20:55
se6astian
documents from cmosis
20:56
FergusL
guesst: I would have expected that from a TVlogic screen
20:56
FergusL
it's a control screen designed for on-camera use
20:57
FergusL
they aren't made for showing precisely what you're shooting
20:58
FergusL
rather showing something deliberatly wrong(~ corrected) for the sake of simply helping the operator what he needs to check
21:00
bootstrap
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21:00
bootstrap
hello again Bertl, se6astian and all.
21:01
Bertl
wb bootstrap!
21:01
bootstrap
I've been performing some due diligence about everything related to this project.
21:01
bootstrap
howdy!
21:01
bootstrap
Sorry I've been silent, but it takes a while to get back up to speed on stuff like this.
21:01
bootstrap
Just last night I was looking into 10Ge PHYs.
21:02
bootstrap
Strange that nobody seems willing to let component prices be known without jumping through hoops.
21:04
Bertl
that is mostly because they want to sell them at the highest possible price
21:05
bootstrap
Sigh. I can't imagine how not knowing the price will get me to design them into products! :-o
21:05
Bertl
i.e. if the chip costs 10cent in production, it can be sold at 10 USD typical, but if you buy more, it can be 2USD or 1USD or even 20 cent :)
21:05
bootstrap
Fortunately I have an NDA with Marvell from during my camera project, so maybe they'll be quick.
21:06
bootstrap
Well, the chips like these are more likely $20 to $80 in 1K to 10K quantities.
21:06
bootstrap
I assume the chip business is all about amortizing their development costs.
21:07
bootstrap
In most cases, anyway.
21:07
bootstrap
When I just looked into FPGAs again recently, I was BLOWN AWAY by how much they imagine they can get for the more elaborate ones. They're just NUTS.
21:08
bootstrap
Take a $5 CPU... put it inside the FPGA... and they want $150 or $1500 extra for it. Yeah, right. Not from this kid.
21:09
bootstrap
They must be focused only on markets like MRI machines or something, where the cost of the machine is so high, the IC costs are irrelevant.
21:09
bootstrap
For those kinds of projects, the flexibility of the FPGA is "worth it".
21:11
bootstrap
Fortunately, the "logic element only" FPGAs are still within reach (cost wise), though still annoyingly expensive.
21:13
guesst
i do not see fpga cost to be expensive
21:13
guesst
they can do more than is required :)
21:13
bootstrap
I assume you're talking about the LE-only variety.
21:13
guesst
yes
21:14
bootstrap
Yes, they are within rearch for this kind of project.... but MUCH too expensive for many other projects they would be nice for.
21:14
guesst
zynq make sense if you need more than 5Gbps between cpu-logic, but that much data the cpu can not process anyway
21:14
guesst
eg?
21:14
bootstrap
?
21:14
bootstrap
What is zynq? Xilinx?
21:15
guesst
yes. fpga+arm
21:15
bootstrap
I've been looking at Altera, because that's what I'm familiar with.
21:15
guesst
the price is > than a fpga + discrete arm... only benefit is sharing the memory :)
21:15
bootstrap
In their case, the new generation of LE-only ones are about $60... but add a microcontroller, and the price goes through the roof.
21:16
guesst
it is not a microcontroller
21:16
guesst
the dualcore arm is maybe more powerful than your phone :)
21:16
bootstrap
The one I used before in my camera project was cyclone 3, and only cost $14 (which I considered very high at the time).
21:16
bootstrap
The new logic-element cyclone 5 parts are $60 minimum.
21:16
guesst
but they are way larger
21:16
bootstrap
I don't have a cell phone!
21:16
guesst
and less power hungry
21:16
bootstrap
Hahaha.
21:16
guesst
and faster
21:17
bootstrap
I haven't really looked into that. How does it compare with a C8051F120 for example?
21:17
bootstrap
I assume it is a 32-bit CPU.
21:17
guesst
8051 ~ 8bit?
21:17
bootstrap
Yes. 100Hz, generally 1~2 cycles per instruction execution.
21:18
guesst
100MIPS stated
21:18
guesst
and 8 bit
21:18
bootstrap
Okay, so similar, but wider I assume (32-bits, right)?
21:18
guesst
a dualcore arm at 1G can do 2000MIPS, 32bit
21:18
guesst
so 20x4x more ? :)
21:18
bootstrap
The problem is, put one of those uC inside the FPGA, and they want hundreds of dollars for it.
21:18
bootstrap
Or at least $100 extra at the very minimum.
21:19
guesst
foga is not for mcu replacement
21:19
bootstrap
So... unless it is impossible for some reason, putting them on the outside seems wiser.
21:19
bootstrap
outside of the FPGA I mean.
21:19
guesst
check pm
21:19
bootstrap
pm?
21:19
guesst
yes, i think that is the way to go
21:19
bootstrap
what is pm?
21:19
guesst
private message? :)
21:20
bootstrap
Oh, where? Is that part of IRC ?
21:20
guesst
yes.
21:20
guesst
what is your client?
21:20
bootstrap
I haven't done much on IRC, so don't know how this works.
21:20
guesst
you have channels - groups
21:20
bootstrap
XChat on linux.
21:20
guesst
many-to-many
21:20
guesst
and then there is private, one-on-one
21:21
guesst
look at bottom - for channels (#name) or (nickname) for private
21:21
bootstrap
Bottom of what? The main window? That's where I'm typing now, and there's nothing here.
21:21
guesst
yes
21:21
guesst
wait
21:21
bootstrap
I'm looking in the menus for "private".
21:21
guesst
menu:
21:22
guesst
view-channel switcher-tabs
21:22
bootstrap
Ah, now I see buttons at the bottom. Click yours?
21:22
guesst
yes.
21:36
SashaC
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gcolburn
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21:51
se6astian
time for bed
21:51
se6astian
good night!
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se6astian
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