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#apertus IRC Channel Logs

2017/02/26

Timezone: UTC


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niemand
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BAndiT1983
changed nick to: BAndiT1983|away
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00:21
Bertl
off to bed now ... have a good one everyone!
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Bertl
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Bertl_zZ
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12:23
Bertl
morning folks!
12:53
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14:29
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14:50
BAndiT1983
i think one of the next team talks can show somet stuff from OC, if someone missed new things which were added recenty (some are buggy at the moment): drive transfer was implemented, currently just for one target path, transfer progress in progress dialog, checksum verification, this one fails currently for 1 of 2 test files
14:50
se6astian
great idea
14:51
se6astian
We will need your guidance how to get everything up and running, what we need in addition to the software (footage, raw files, etc.)
14:51
se6astian
and what we can already do and show with it
14:52
BAndiT1983
no problem, i would be very glad if someone can test it beside me
14:52
BAndiT1983
real footage from axiom would be the best thing, as i partially use arri footage :D
14:52
BAndiT1983
but as you've probably seen in the screenshot, there are also MOV files from apertus which were used
14:54
BAndiT1983
another question is, if we want to provide VMs for camera firmware development and OC, i've created a task for camera one in Lab, cause i was testing QEMU recently
14:54
se6astian
great
14:54
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14:55
BAndiT1983
i think it oculd draw more people, cause it's tedious for some to set everything up, although there are not many requirements and i'm simplifying it step by step
14:55
se6astian
sounds good
14:56
se6astian
I dont even think a VM has to be very polished or small filesize as long as its easy to just start and run OC
14:57
BAndiT1983
my idea is to take ubuntu and install it in OEM mode, so the user can create custom account with password at first start
14:58
BAndiT1983
i would add some scripts which have to be executed to setup the basic system
14:58
BAndiT1983
it's not just OC, i don't want to be selfish :D i also could create one, which has scripts for QEMU download and build
14:59
BAndiT1983
especially for GSoC
15:00
se6astian
sounds good
15:01
BAndiT1983
we jsut need a little discussion about it, maybe tomorrow evening after team round
15:07
se6astian
good idea
15:31
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davidak
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16:00
se6astian
Hi MichaelH
16:01
MichaelH
Hi Sebastian
16:04
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16:05
BAndiT1983
found this interesting, if someone is not following blendernation -> https://www.blendernation.com/2017/02/23/man-high-castle-season-2-vfx/
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16:35
se6astian
https://lab.apertus.org/T741
16:36
Rex0r
Bandit - https://s10.postimg.org/5zyok6f3d/Screenshot_2017_02_26_17_35_31.png
16:37
BAndiT1983
have looked MLT up, but don't know hat to use it for at the moment, has too many features and most of them are not required at the moemtn
16:37
BAndiT1983
or somebody could evaluate and tell what it should be used for
16:37
Rex0r
Link was - https://mltframework.org/projects/
16:38
BAndiT1983
*what *moment
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d0
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BAndiT1983
ah, the right man joined
16:53
BAndiT1983
hello d0
16:55
d0
Hey thought I drop by here
16:55
BAndiT1983
good idea
16:56
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16:56
d0
As an old blender user and a creator of films I am quite curious what will happen with this project
16:56
rexbron
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16:57
BAndiT1983
me too :D also blender user here
16:57
BAndiT1983
posted a link to man in the high castle making of in blender, nice to see that people use it for bigger productions
16:58
niemand
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17:00
d0
Currently rendering an animation since 3 days. No need for heating anymore : )
17:01
d0
Is also for a short movie
17:01
BAndiT1983
i know this dilemma, especially when i render volumetrics, like smoke and fire in blender
17:02
d0
But they have an incredibly fast update cycle. It is like having christmas all year
17:02
BAndiT1983
:D true
17:04
BAndiT1983
are you the same guy who commented on facebook?
17:04
d0
Are there any mockups or drafts what about a opencine UI?
17:04
d0
yeah
17:04
BAndiT1983
i'm asking so i can upload OC UI screenshot, just a moment, have to start debugger again
17:05
d0
no need to hurry : )
17:07
BAndiT1983
https://lab.apertus.org/T341
17:08
BAndiT1983
no problem here, as my VM is running, was just looking in lab around
17:09
BAndiT1983
some things will be changed, like overwrite/checksum boxes, as they should be set per target, at least in my opinion
17:09
BAndiT1983
the UI is not a mockup, it's real, hope to get a screencast soon, when some bugs were fixed
17:12
RexOrCine
Welcome to the community d0
17:14
BAndiT1983
i see, that people could get a wrong idea about OC -> twitter: @LeeABrian so I may not require OpenShot to edit?
17:14
BAndiT1983
in first place it's a backup solution for now, the module which will be implemented after OCBackup is stable and usable is a RAW clip editor, for color grading and simple cutting
17:16
BAndiT1983
people could suggest other things also, but i'm not aiming at NLE editing currently, more on "on-set" features to help people there
17:18
BAndiT1983
and for better apertus promotion, i would still like to include things which use beta camera features
17:19
BAndiT1983
like live preview and control, similar to tethering in darktable
17:20
d0
So to put it simple it is meant to work as a tool to gather and backup data directly from the camera (or removable drives) to whatever backup location(s)
17:21
BAndiT1983
yes, this applies to OCBackup, but it's intended to be one module of many in OC toolsuite
17:21
d0
I often used Teracopy with file hash, or hand woven rsync scripts on set for it
17:22
BAndiT1983
i wanted all-in-one solution, but some guy told me, that it would be better to split it, so different departments of film production can work independently
17:22
d0
it is definitly something that would be very useful
17:23
d0
I think it makes sense to at least make OCBackup a seperate application
17:24
BAndiT1983
plan is also to create OCManage, so one can sort his library and mark the files, also like rawtherapee/darktable do, then OCProcess for simple color-grading and cutting the clip
17:24
d0
I imagine using it on set. It should be lightweight, stable and secure (data integrity)
17:24
BAndiT1983
that's my plan
17:24
BAndiT1983
backup feature is there, but it's buggy at the moment
17:24
d0
well I think that is a reasonable structure
17:25
d0
and it will launch and then you have to select the mode?
17:25
niemand
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17:26
BAndiT1983
i've shown you the launcher in lab, would place all the separate apps there, also ones which will be created as UIs for command-line tools from other apertus repository
17:31
micha_
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17:31
BAndiT1983
Sebastian, Rex, are you there?
17:34
d0
Good idea : )
17:37
Rex0r
Aye.
17:38
BAndiT1983
want to test VM for easier distribution of OC dev environment, does anything speak against ubuntu?
17:39
BAndiT1983
my preference is linuxmint usually, but don't know what the people are using mostly
17:45
Rex0r
I'm gonna give you access to the OpenCine acct. It's a good platform for this sort of thing and you can do polls. (I'm on Mint by the way)
17:45
BAndiT1983
argh, please don't
17:45
BAndiT1983
i am a developer and prefer dark basement :D
17:45
Rex0r
XD
17:46
BAndiT1983
not really a basement, don't have one here
17:47
BAndiT1983
i'm really not a social network guy, maybe i've grown beside the age when it's interesting to exhibit yourself
17:50
BAndiT1983
alright, will go for LM18.1 (with MATE for higher performance) for now, does not remember if it has OEM mode so test is required, if someone wants different one, then we can still decide again, scripts should stay mostly the same imho
17:52
BAndiT1983
i'm at the point where i'm tired of thinking about preferences of people, but should mostly decide, otherwise there won't be feedback from the outer world, just like apple -> "you need thins phone, or your life is waste"
17:54
d0
Well I think it doesn't matter that much and in the end there will be someone complaining no matter what you decide for, so meh
17:55
Bertl
I completely agree, pick whatever suits your purpose best
17:55
BAndiT1983
gentoo!!!! :D
17:55
Bertl
(or if that isn't clear, pick the easier one :)
17:55
BAndiT1983
just a joke, i'm not that crazy linux user
17:56
BAndiT1983
linuxmint is ubuntu, but with better performance, so apt-get all the way
17:56
BAndiT1983
d0: OC runs also under windows, trying to develop it partly under linux and partly under windows, to remove errors of different compilers
17:58
d0
I used all min, ubuntu and windows so everything is fine with me : ) Mostly use windows in (film) production though
17:59
d0
with the Linux subsystem in Windows 10 it got at least bearable to code there also
17:59
BAndiT1983
using it for AE, as my hobby film group prefers it
18:00
BAndiT1983
currently i'm developing in LM18.1 VM under win8.1
18:00
Bertl
there is no 'Linux' in Microsoft Windows :)
18:00
BAndiT1983
pfff
18:00
BAndiT1983
i've also tried win98 on my android phone
18:01
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18:05
d0
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_Subsystem_for_Linux well it is better than using powershell
18:06
BAndiT1983
currently still avoiding win10, but will have to live with it on the new tablet, if i order one finally
18:07
d0
I find it by far more "enjoyable" than 8, at least gui wise
18:07
Bertl
well, no doubt that a unix is better ...
18:08
BAndiT1983
:D Bertl at his best
18:08
Bertl
but a 'Linux' requires a Linux Kernel ...
18:09
Bertl
so while Microsoft is jumping on the 'Linux' train, it is just a misnomer
18:09
BAndiT1983
Bertl, by the way, when do you have time to test QEMU?
18:09
BAndiT1983
what do they want achieve by doing it?
18:10
Bertl
as soon as I finish testing the recently assembled PCBs
18:10
BAndiT1983
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Linux_distributions
18:10
BAndiT1983
many quality problems or just general tests?
18:12
Bertl
Microsoft realized, quite some time ago, that they cannot survive if they do not play the open source and Linux cards sooner or later
18:12
BAndiT1983
so they opened a lot of frameworks, e.g. .NET
18:12
Bertl
yes, and now they are trying to market Linux as their newest achievement :)
18:12
d0
I think they realized that people would abandon windows just to have bash running.
18:13
BAndiT1983
bash is not everything, i use it also, but an UI is faster to use sometime
18:13
BAndiT1983
just imagine OC as bash :D
18:13
Bertl
the shell is not about being fast
18:14
Bertl
the shell is about being flexible
18:14
d0
So they tried to implement something like it. For people like me who cannot run linux for software reasons but still love to have bash, this is a good thing.
18:14
d0
still not a Microsoft lover though
18:15
BAndiT1983
i just take best of both worlds, FFMPEG binding in OC was easier under linux, under Windows it's still not working, but will fix it when i have time, linux first at the moemtn
18:19
BAndiT1983
thanks Rex, will try it as soon as there is stable version and new ideas are required
18:32
se6astian
added another oc logo attempt
18:32
se6astian
https://lab.apertus.org/T341
18:33
BAndiT1983
nice one, d0 your turn :)
18:34
se6astian
queen on A4 :)
18:34
BAndiT1983
what do you mean?
18:35
d0
I need to reflect a little on the structure of the project. OpenCine is the whole thing. Then there is OpenCineBackup, OpenCineManager, OpenCineProcess and so on. All of which are subsets of OpenCine
18:36
se6astian
chess
18:36
BAndiT1983
:D
18:36
se6astian
tower on F8
18:36
se6astian
your tunr
18:36
se6astian
turn
18:37
BAndiT1983
knight at C3
18:37
BAndiT1983
i thought you were talking about the band
18:45
BAndiT1983
oha, what the hell, why is our chat conversation posted in twitter?
18:45
BAndiT1983
https://twitter.com/apertusOpenCine/status/835922951820230657
18:45
d0
Me too. And he said it while I was creating a DIN A4 artboard in Illustrator so I was like "???"
18:45
d0
Oh I am famous now
18:45
d0
: D
18:46
BAndiT1983
second thought was, that Sebastian is looking after women in an Audi A4 :D
18:49
Bertl
should I be worried? :)
18:51
BAndiT1983
?
18:53
Bertl
nah, probably it is fine ...
19:04
BAndiT1983
d0, it's not mess, it's the usual environment of an engineer ;)
19:10
d0
it is even worse, I am actually a student of fine arts : )
19:11
d0
(doing a lot of analog audio electronics for modular synthesizers though.)
19:11
BAndiT1983
wouldn't guessed that, if i see soldering iron and oscilloscope there
19:11
BAndiT1983
oha, nice one
19:11
BAndiT1983
we were typing in parallel, so it wasn't sarcastic, just badly timed
19:14
d0
haha na didn't read it as sarcasm : ) I like my creative chaos
19:15
BAndiT1983
it's the creative chaos which helps to be creative
19:16
d0
It is just a high-complexity form of order : )
19:17
BAndiT1983
but just for engineers and artists, but it's a pity that other people don't think so
19:18
d0
OCBackup â also meant for encoding of raw files? You mentioned FFMPEG so I'd guess so?
19:19
BAndiT1983
at the moment for decoding of MOV files from the external recorder, e.g. Shogun, but there is also CinemaDNG file reader in source code
19:20
BAndiT1983
but it's a good point, encoding to different formats should be also added later, e.g. for OCProcess, before that i don't know what i should encode for, maybe besides metadata, but that can be solved by using MXF container or similar
19:21
BAndiT1983
i need more input from people who actively have to do with film shooting and know what's required and used nowadays
19:24
BAndiT1983
my idea is to carry most things, like metadata, externally, e.g. in XML file, and not to embed it into files, because it's easier to write parsers that way
19:25
BAndiT1983
but it's a point which have to be discussed with Alex, who wrote the converter from MOV stream to DNG, if i'm not mistaken and possibly Bertl
19:25
BAndiT1983
*has to be discussed
19:25
d0
Well I study film (ofically as said "fine arts") actually and did 5 films as a DOP last year, so shoot
19:26
BAndiT1983
i'm doing post-processing of 2008 shots, so not up to date at the moment :D
19:26
d0
MXF is certainly a standard
19:26
d0
either that or Quicktime with Prores
19:27
d0
I like MXF more, because it is more compatible cross platform. The Prorescodec on Windows is sort of slow
19:27
BAndiT1983
heard of prores from some people, but i still lack the knowledge, have to search for some examples of containers, so i know how they are used
19:28
BAndiT1983
my main profession is software development, so film stuff has to be grasped while developing OC
19:29
d0
Defacto if you buy yourself a Shogun Flame 10bit 4K recorder today, the two containers it uses are MXF (using DNxHD or DNxHR) or Quicktime (using Prores)
19:29
BAndiT1983
Geez, even more format definitions
19:30
d0
I work also with image sequences (DPX, PNG, EXR, depending on the task)
19:31
d0
but if I had to choose one file format and use it forever, I would not feel bad using mxf with a good DNxHD/DNxHR Codec)
19:31
BAndiT1983
CinemaDNG was selected as format back when i started, in the future we can extend it of course, especially EXR is interesting, i've tried to import blender things with depth into AE some time ago, works fine, plus HDR is there
19:32
BAndiT1983
don't forget to think about the licensing stuff, as many formats are restricted
19:32
d0
Oh cinemadng is also fine if you have the space. Working with 8 TB of it right now.
19:32
BAndiT1983
i mean not technically
19:32
d0
legally
19:33
d0
oh FFMPEG also supports DNxHD with 10bits
19:34
BAndiT1983
very good, then i don't have to bother about new libs
19:34
BAndiT1983
OC should be as slim and as fast as possible
19:34
BAndiT1983
but not slim on features
19:35
BAndiT1983
now it's the fourth icon, after reordering, hard to decide for me as Libra :D
19:36
Bertl
off for now ... bbl
19:36
Bertl
changed nick to: bertl_oO
19:36
bertl_oO
changed nick to: Bertl_oO
19:36
BAndiT1983
just think of icon set for OCBackup, OCManage and OCProcess, or other apps, they should be similar but distinct per app
19:54
d0
sth among those lines? https://lab.apertus.org/file/data/f4kopjwxvo5bxygkflit/PHID-FILE-n3iesiiqhdf455zrcpxa/OC_Structure-01.png
19:55
d0
(took me 2 minutes, so there is room for improvement)
19:55
BAndiT1983
you should change the access to the file, just look on the left side for "Files" and then select yours, then "Edit file" and select other option, as i get restricted file
19:55
BAndiT1983
"You do not have permission to view this object."
19:55
BAndiT1983
happens to me also every time i upload images and forget to adjust it
19:55
d0
https://lab.apertus.org/T341
19:56
d0
there (sorry for png transparency)
19:56
d0
jsut open it in a new tab
19:56
BAndiT1983
no problem, looking at it currently, nice idea, what about recognition, when icons are small?
19:57
d0
The question is: will they be? : )
19:57
BAndiT1983
plan is to mainly use launcher which shows bigger ones and only launcher has icon on desktop or in the favorite panel
19:57
BAndiT1983
alright, it seems you already got the idea ;)
19:58
d0
for smal icons maybe we could add letters like "OB", "OM", "OP" usw
19:58
BAndiT1983
good idea, we should definitely test it soon
19:59
BAndiT1983
i would prepare a VM, so people can test or develop OC without much hassle
19:59
d0
cool : )
20:04
RexOrCine
I like OCProcess a lot
20:04
RexOrCine
OCManager is ok
20:05
BAndiT1983
looks good, but still thinking about most recognizable thing in video processing
20:05
RexOrCine
Not sure about Backup though. I thought about something like building blocks. eg, the O being pixelated with some of the pixels not added or flying off
20:06
d0
Agreed
20:06
BAndiT1983
also a good idea, i'll let d0 decide for a moment
20:07
RexOrCine
Reducing the check boxes to two in Manager would probably help with smaller versions of the icon
20:07
d0
agreed
20:07
BAndiT1983
so i can concetrate on preparation of the VM, which should help a lot when someone wants to try the thing
20:08
d0
already changed it to two checkboxes, also made them a little bigger
20:08
BAndiT1983
i will extract the json file which configures the launcher, it's basic currently, but can be extended later
20:08
d0
Process looks nice to me, wouldn't change a thing
20:08
BAndiT1983
then you can try it yourself, without recompilation, like it was planned
20:08
d0
cool
20:09
d0
Backup. I will try some data thingie
20:09
BAndiT1983
i must say, FB post with previous screenshot is gathering some people, which is nice
20:14
RexOrCine
Oh, the OCBackup icon in labs is better though.
20:16
d0
yeah I fucked up removing the contour
20:17
BAndiT1983
prepare them on dark background first, i mean your A4 structure diagram, so transparency problem will be gone for now
20:17
RexOrCine
Process is just great
20:57
BAndiT1983
so, off to bed, will be back after work tomorrow, let's see what google decides
20:57
BAndiT1983
good night
20:57
BAndiT1983
changed nick to: BAndiT1983|away
21:02
se6astian
I am off too
21:02
se6astian
good night
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se6astian
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intracube
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