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01:25 | davidak | RexOrCine se6astian the "latest news" is actually just a copy of an old article, but with broken layout https://www.apertus.org/
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01:28 | davidak | also, i will probably not find time soon to review the 2 proposals, so don't wait for my feedback
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03:29 | Bertl_oO | off to bed now ... have a good one everyone!
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08:01 | se6astian | thanks davidak[m], fixed
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09:36 | Bertl | morning folks!
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10:15 | Bertl | off for now ... bbl
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15:54 | se6astian | hi DanielCS!
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15:54 | DanielCS | Hello! how are you today?
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15:55 | se6astian | good good, you?
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15:55 | DanielCS | Also good, thank you.
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15:55 | DanielCS | I saw the picture of the plugin module you sent
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15:56 | DanielCS | Is the idea to have these boards fully enclosed?
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15:59 | se6astian | well there are 2 kinds of plugin modules
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15:59 | se6astian | ones that are short enough so the AXIOM Beta Compact enclosure already covers top and bottom side
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15:59 | se6astian | and ones that are longer and stick out of the AXIOM Beta Compact enclosure
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16:00 | se6astian | if you look into onshape the "AXIOM Beta Full Enclosure for Drawing" Assembly
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16:01 | DanielCS | Are there any shorter modules that use both slots?
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16:01 | se6astian | not yet, but its possible
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16:01 | se6astian | actually we already have one
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16:01 | se6astian | the tripple pmod plugin module
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16:02 | DanielCS | https://wiki.apertus.org/index.php/AXIOM_Beta/Camera_Structure#Plugin_Modules_and_Shields
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16:02 | DanielCS | second on the list?
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16:02 | se6astian | 3x PMOD Plugin Module
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16:02 | se6astian | yes
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16:03 | DanielCS | Gotcha. And I see in the onshape the casings
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16:04 | se6astian | that should also be the same part I 3d printed and emailed you the picture earlier toda
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16:05 | se6astian | the enclosure allows around 12.5mm more length for such modules
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16:05 | se6astian | but then a hole at the top/bottom will be exposed
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16:05 | se6astian | if it gets any longer
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16:05 | se6astian | you see what I mean?
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16:06 | DanielCS | Let me load up my copy so I can edit and move it around.
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16:07 | DanielCS | I see
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16:09 | se6astian | so any longer module needs a more complex designed cartridge enclosure
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16:09 | se6astian | for top/bottom sides as well as the left side
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16:09 | se6astian | a two part assembly at least
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16:10 | DanielCS | That makes sense
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16:10 | se6astian | as explained in the email I actually think that covering top/bottom/left side not all the way in but only starting where the compact enclosure ends would make everything much simpler for us (because of the tight spaces)
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16:10 | DanielCS | And I'm designing based off the existing boards?
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16:11 | DanielCS | I see what you mean
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16:11 | se6astian | yes you can use the single HDMI plugin module base design in use currently
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16:11 | se6astian | and just make it longer towards the back
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16:11 | se6astian | just add 40mm or so for the first concept
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16:12 | se6astian | I will give you edit access to the main doc now in version 8
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16:12 | se6astian | then we do not need to transfer/merge parts/assemblies from different documents
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16:12 | DanielCS | Okay, excellent.
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16:13 | DanielCS | Also I think some of my last project didn't transfer over. I can try to re-import that.
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16:15 | DanielCS | So is the +40mm board the dimensions of the new 4K HDMI plugin module?
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16:17 | se6astian | sure, please move all your changes/additions into V08
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16:17 | se6astian | is your oneshape user your gmail email address?
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16:18 | DanielCS | Here it is: daniel_sinclair
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16:19 | se6astian | hmm onshape doesnt seem to be able to find you
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16:19 | DanielCS | perhaps try a space instead of the underscore?
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16:20 | se6astian | DanielCS: So is the +40mm board the dimensions of the new 4K HDMI plugin module? <- that module does not exist yet
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16:20 | se6astian | but you can use the SDI module as reference if you want: https://wiki.apertus.org/index.php/SDI_Plugin_Module
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16:20 | se6astian | DanielCS: perhaps try a space instead of the underscore? doesnt seem to work
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16:21 | se6astian | it accepted your gmail address though
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16:21 | DanielCS | Oh good!
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16:23 | DanielCS | the 4K 60fps one?
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16:23 | se6astian | dual 6g sdi
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16:24 | DanielCS | Gotcha.
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16:24 | se6astian | felix_: will provide the dimensions of the new PCB
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16:25 | se6astian | but the actual length should make no difference for the design (should be parametric)
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16:25 | se6astian | have you use a variable yet in onshape?
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16:25 | se6astian | https://cad.onshape.com/help/Content/variable.htm
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16:25 | DanielCS | Great!
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16:26 | se6astian | the module length should definitely be a variable
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16:26 | DanielCS | Oh I have not! That looks to be super useful
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16:26 | se6astian | it is :)
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16:26 | DanielCS | I've just been using dimensions until now.
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16:27 | DanielCS | So how about the cutouts at the rear of the module>
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16:27 | se6astian | well for most lengths dimensions are the way to go
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16:28 | se6astian | cutouts at the rear of the module should be possible but I would just leave a plain surface for now
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16:28 | se6astian | do think about connectors on pcbs though and the way the PCB is put into the plugin module enclosure at assembly
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16:28 | DanielCS | Alright.
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16:29 | se6astian | so there is nothing in the way when sliding/screwing it in
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16:29 | DanielCS | How is the plugin locked into the camera body?
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16:29 | se6astian | there is a screwknob on the right side
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16:30 | se6astian | looks similar to this: https://live-katalog.ganter-griff.de/catalog-images/ganter/e23ebeb0-f0f6-448f-840e-369710e735d9/DIN-464-Hohe-Raendelschrauben-Edelstahl.jpg
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16:30 | DanielCS | And a threaded hole on the module case?
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16:31 | se6astian | exactly
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16:33 | DanielCS | Are these ultimately to be CNC milled parts?
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16:34 | se6astian | yes
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16:36 | se6astian | can you check please if the gmail invite worked
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16:36 | se6astian | if you have edit access to the document now
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16:36 | se6astian | ah I think I see you as active user already
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16:36 | se6astian | great!
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16:36 | DanielCS | It worked!
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16:37 | se6astian | perfect
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16:37 | DanielCS | And you'd like me to work in the "for drawing" one?
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16:38 | se6astian | if you can fix the orientation issues of the "Main" assembly you can use that one as well
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16:38 | se6astian | but the "for drawing" should be similar - I think it doesnt contain the shell which makes no difference for this...
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16:38 | DanielCS | Okay. What is the reason for having the two different pages?
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16:40 | se6astian | I seem to needed one version "for a drawing" somehow
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16:41 | DanielCS | Ah.
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16:42 | DanielCS | Now for these boards, how far will the longest stick past the entire camera body?
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16:44 | se6astian | how do yo mean?
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16:45 | DanielCS | The SDI board for example, when inserted, does it stick out past the back of the camera?
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16:45 | se6astian | yes
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16:46 | DanielCS | How far past?
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16:46 | se6astian | sebastian: felix_: will provide the dimensions of the new PCB
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16:46 | se6astian | I will go next door and ask him :)
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16:46 | DanielCS | Okay haha. Send my regards.
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16:48 | felix_ | se6astian just measured the dimensions of the module: length with pcie connector: 62.5mm and without pcie connector: 54.3mm
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16:53 | DanielCS | Thank you! Hmm, that does stick out a bit.
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16:54 | se6astian | yes
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16:55 | se6astian | any further questions or anything still unclear?
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16:55 | se6astian | cause I need to get to the kitchen and start cooking :)
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16:58 | DanielCS | Of course, I think I'm good to start. I'll do a variable length single connector and a variable length double connector.
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16:58 | DanielCS | Thank you!
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17:12 | se6astian | My arse has fallen out. Be back later.
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17:14 | felix_ | from the end of the pcb to where the metal should be is a distance of maybe 2mm, since the conector isn't infinitesimal thin
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17:15 | felix_ | the lenght of the sata module might also be a bit different than the sdi module, but probably not much shorter
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17:20 | DanielCS | I see. I'll get cracking then.
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18:08 | Spirit532 | felix_, it's going to be dual sata, right?
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18:45 | se6astian | dual 6g sdi would correspond to dual sata3 (6g) I assume in terms of bandwidth
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19:04 | Spirit532 | it would be handy to just have two hotswap 2.5" SSD docks
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19:05 | Spirit532 | the only issue is - I've quoted basically all of China for suppliers, and I found.. three
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19:05 | Spirit532 | and all of them have a minimum order quantity of 100-200
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19:05 | Spirit532 | (at $11-18 a piece)
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19:08 | felix_ | yep, dual 6g sata. the fpga would allow 4x 6g sata, but probably not easu to route on the 4 layers
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19:08 | felix_ | *easy
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19:11 | Spirit532 | dual is plenty for DCI4K raw at 60fps
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19:12 | Spirit532 | could probably push 70-80 if you had the highest end SSDs
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19:12 | Spirit532 | interleaved recording
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19:15 | Spirit532 | though if someone wants to do 4 SSDs in parallel to push the extreme frame rates out of the cvm12k sensor, I'd be interested in seeing such a contraption
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19:28 | se6astian|away | changed nick to: se6astian
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19:29 | se6astian | Spirit532: sounds interesting, what part exactly did you get quoted?
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19:30 | Spirit532 | se6astian, just the assembly
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19:30 | Spirit532 | https://i.spirit.re/Liblo.png
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19:30 | Spirit532 | embeddable into a case
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19:30 | Spirit532 | and relatively small
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19:30 | Spirit532 | I've ordered two samples of that one ^
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19:30 | Spirit532 | $12.3/piece in 200 quantity
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19:31 | se6astian | right, looks good
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19:31 | Spirit532 | I'm talking to what I'm assuming is the actual, original supplier of these
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19:32 | Spirit532 | but yeah, can't buy less than 200
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19:32 | Spirit532 | fewer than*
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19:32 | se6astian | well you can just get them from a local reseller for 5 times the price is low quantities no?
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19:32 | Spirit532 | yeah, around that
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19:33 | Spirit532 | $35-50 a piece from resellers on aliexpress
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19:33 | Spirit532 | but they're the most questionable resellers possible
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19:34 | Spirit532 | you can also buy the individual 2.5" bays, so a 4-drive setup could be built
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19:55 | se6astian | how did you manage to get to the source of their supply? :)
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20:30 | Spirit532 | se6astian, lots, and lots, and lots of searching
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20:30 | Spirit532 | I'm very good at abusing parametric searches and getting results I want :P
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20:30 | Spirit532 | that, and mass-messaging distributors on alibaba
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20:36 | se6astian | so one of them in the end gave up their source, or are they open to share that kind of information?
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20:37 | Spirit532 | I just found the cheapest one that had something in stock and knew about samples
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20:38 | Spirit532 | the rep said that it's their product and they have samples in stock, but minimum orders require manufacturing
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20:38 | Spirit532 | which is accurate enough for me to conclude that they're the original supplier, they just don't keep things in stock for bulk orders
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20:41 | se6astian | interesting
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21:24 | se6astian | maybe you can help me in this regard with finding sources
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21:24 | se6astian | for the AXIOM Remote we decided to use this TFT: https://www.adafruit.com/product/1947
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21:25 | se6astian | unfortunately we did not succeed at getting in touch with someone in charge at adafruit about purchasing just the TFT without the PCB
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21:26 | se6astian | there are tons of similar lcds on aliexpress: https://de.aliexpress.com/wholesale?catId=0&initiative_id=SB_20181117132605&SearchText=240*320+ili9341+2.8%22
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21:27 | se6astian | but none I found so far has the same pin out
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21:45 | felix_ | https://www.buydisplay.com/ might be worth a look
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21:46 | Spirit532 | se6astian, no!
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21:46 | Spirit532 | adafruit is a gigantic ripoff
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21:46 | Spirit532 | a 2.8"
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21:46 | Spirit532 | 2.8" 320x240 with an ILI9341 controller is $3, not $45
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21:47 | Spirit532 | I can do sourcing pretty well
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21:47 | Spirit532 | but as felix_ suggested, buydisplay is a good source - EastRising is a primarily B2B company, they just have a B2C storefront
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21:48 | Spirit532 | their prices aren't the lowest, but I did buy from them, and it came with good documentation and support
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21:48 | Spirit532 | as for the axiom remote - these SPI displays are really not the best option, as their refresh rates are abysmal, even if you drive it from an overclocked output
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21:49 | Spirit532 | I would also advise against buying on aliexpress, because it's a lottery on what you're going to get
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21:50 | felix_ | beware though that the samples you'll get are probably from the best bins and when ordering in volume the displays might be from the other bins as well
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21:50 | Spirit532 | buydisplay don't sell samples
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21:51 | Spirit532 | they just sell from their bulk supply at increased prices
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21:51 | felix_ | hmm, might be that i mixed up the sources where that was an issue
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21:51 | Spirit532 | most Chinese companies do that when you ask for samples
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21:52 | Spirit532 | especially if they're free samples
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21:52 | Spirit532 | they'll send you 2-3 of their best bin for free, as long as you pay for shipping
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21:52 | felix_ | also that was meant as a rather general statement and not specifically for the company i linked
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21:54 | Spirit532 | I still don't get why people buy from adafruit
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21:55 | Spirit532 | all they do is take pretty pictures of generic OEM parts and write arduino libraries for them
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22:15 | se6astian | well nobody likes create hardware and software just to evaluate an LCD
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22:15 | se6astian | the adafruit thing is plug and play and we wanted to check the display
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22:16 | se6astian | its pretty good in terms of viewing angle, contrast, colors
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22:16 | se6astian | and refresh rate is really not an issue now that we operate it in parallel mode
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22:21 | Spirit532 | "pretty good in terms of viewing angle, contrast, colors" is the biggest fault of noname chinese displays
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22:22 | Spirit532 | you get all those parameters at random from batch to batch
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22:23 | Spirit532 | the second biggest fault is inconsistent flex lengths and dimensions
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22:32 | se6astian | so what would you recommend?
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22:38 | Spirit532 | buydisplay is a good option
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22:38 | Spirit532 | not the cheapest but it comes with a legible datasheet
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22:38 | se6astian | right, they only seem to have one product that fits exactly what we are using so far
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22:38 | se6astian | https://www.buydisplay.com/default/serial-spi-2-8-tft-lcd-module-display-320x240-optional-touch-screen
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22:38 | Spirit532 | go for that then
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22:38 | se6astian | that makes choosing easy :)
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22:39 | se6astian | thanks, will read datasheet and co tomorrow
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22:39 | se6astian | going to bed now
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22:39 | se6astian | good night
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