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| 08:55 | se6astian | good morning
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| 10:00 | Bertl | morning folks!
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| 10:22 | Dan1 | Greetings
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| 10:23 | se6astian | hello dan!
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| 10:23 | se6astian | how is it going?
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| 10:24 | Dan1 | Its a Saturday but I had a typical overnight 'how to' question worm in my head regarding raw2dng conversion
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| 10:24 | Dan1 | yes goof thanks Sebastian I got your email this morning thank you
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| 10:24 | Dan1 | Good thanks, not goof :-)
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| 10:24 | se6astian | :)
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| 10:25 | se6astian | gotta go to the supermarket
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| 10:25 | se6astian | bbl
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| 10:26 | Dan1 | No problems I'll leave a couple of questions on here and see replies later on, thanks.
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| 10:33 | Bertl | I can answer technical questions but not grading or proprietary software related ones :)
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| 10:34 | Dan1 | Questions are regarding the raw2dng processing, the DNGs and getting into the next stage of colour processing
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| 10:34 | Dan1 | Hi Bertl good morning
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| 10:35 | Bertl | and a good one to you too
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| 10:35 | danieeeel | so what the questions are?
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| 10:36 | danieeeel | changed nick to: danieel
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| 10:36 | Dan1 | converting the snap.raw12 files to DNG via raw2dng is all working fine, but these raw files are not RGN DNGs correct
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| 10:37 | Dan1 | RGB DNG I mean
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| 10:39 | Dan1 | Using ImageMagick I can create colour previews as test_color.png
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| 10:40 | Dan1 | How do I demosaic the RAW DNGs (with their magenta bias) to useable RGB versions to work onwards with.
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| 10:41 | Bertl | you need a tool which does proper debayering
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| 10:41 | Dan1 | And if that processing workflow is correct (snap.raw12 - DNG via raw2dng - demosaic and new RGB DNG debayered) can I debayer to Cineon Log/Log C for example :-)
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| 10:41 | Bertl | there is a primitive script for ImageMagick which does a simple debayer to roughly full HD
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| 10:42 | Bertl | (for quick preview)
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| 10:42 | Bertl | for good debayering to 4k, check with alexML_ or getzingo (Max)
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| 10:43 | Bertl | I would be careful with the raw2dng, while it works reasonably well, it might result in unexpected color changes
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| 10:44 | Bertl | https://wiki.apertus.org/index.php?title=Axiom_Alpha_Software#Simple_debayer_with_ImageMagick:
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| 10:44 | Bertl | the command can easily be adapted to raw12, by changing .raw16 to .raw12 and -depth 16 to -depth 12
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| 10:49 | Dan1 | Thanks I will try the simple version, it looks like it outputs to PNG like the preveiw, so I can ask alexML or Max for full 4K debayer to DNG or DPX as Loc encoded so I can go grading?
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| 10:49 | Dan1 | Can I output to another format such as DNG on that simple debayer by changing the .PNG to .DNG?
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| 10:50 | Bertl | If ImageMagick can write DNGs, then yes, but I don't think so
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| 10:50 | Bertl | you can produce TIFFs though
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| 10:52 | Dan1 | I will have a play and see what it lets me create. or even Open EXR would be good, I will have a go mind. TIFFs is good for getting going.
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| 10:59 | Dan1 | png and TIFF worked fine
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| 11:09 | Dan1 | Tried dng and cdng extension but no luck
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| 11:30 | Bertl | yeah, thought so, DNG is too complicated
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| 11:32 | Dan1 | There is a ML RAW 1.2.0 that does a DNG to 'Force Linear' as DNG but it can't read the raw2dng created via the snap.raw12 files. Still looking though.
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| 11:37 | Bertl | the problem with DNG imho is that it doesn't really handle raw data, although it can store raw data
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| 11:37 | Bertl | i.e. you need to specify a color transformation on the data to have correct DNG
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| 11:37 | Bertl | (as far as I understood)
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| 11:37 | Bertl | and that's the chicken-egg problem with real raw data
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| 11:38 | Bertl | you want to find a proper transformation for the real raw data, so you create a DNG (with a fake transformation), to create the proper transformation you'll want for the DNG in the first place
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| 11:40 | Dan1 | Also it seems ARC and others like RAWTherapee and Darktable aren't working with these dng files, dcraw and libraw I think are more used to ML created RAW files from their own software recording their RAW recordings from Canon cameras etc. AXIOM created DNGs via raw2dng still need that demosaic/debayer it seems (linear DNG) to be useable, but yes the correct colour transform needs to be there too.
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| 11:41 | Dan1 | Yes I see thanks Bert.
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| 11:44 | Bertl | best to chat with alexML_ regarding raw2dng for the Beta
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| 11:45 | Bertl | there are several versions out there already and I think they could benefit from some testing and feedback#
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| 11:46 | Dan1 | Can I email alexML_ and Max for some feedback?
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| 11:49 | Bertl | sure, why not
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| 11:53 | Rex0r | It may be more worthwhile posting on the Magic Lantern forum though.
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| 11:53 | Rex0r | There are a lot of clever folks there besides Alex, who's very active anyway.
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| 12:03 | Dan1 | Bert sent email to you, thanks.
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| 12:03 | Dan1 | Yes Rex the forum is pretty active
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| 13:17 | toxitobi | Hey guys, I just read https://www.slashcam.de/news/single/Clever-geloest--Apertus-Axiom-Beta-kann-UHD-RAW-via-12885.html About the 4k raw recording- this is absolutly amazing keep it up
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| 13:19 | toxitobi | this articel links to https://www.apertus.org/axiom-beta-uhd-raw-mode-explained-article-may-2016 , which i just don't know how to get via any menu on https://www.apertus.org/ is there a secret trick?
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| 13:21 | se6astian | hi toxitobi
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| 13:21 | se6astian | that article is not released yet :)
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| 13:21 | se6astian | we will release it on monday
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| 13:22 | toxitobi | Well it is now but not by you facebook has it already too.
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| 13:23 | se6astian | yes :)
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| 13:24 | toxitobi | This is really great news, so many HD-Recorder can now record 4k Raw
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| 13:28 | se6astian | unfortunately not that many recorders can actually record 1080p60
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| 13:28 | se6astian | most max out at 1080p30
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| 13:30 | Bertl | but there is still hope if you got two of those
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| 13:30 | Bertl | i.e. you can record two 1080p30 streams from the Beta and use this for the same process
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| 13:31 | Bertl | probably even higher resolution if the recorder supports it
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| 13:32 | toxitobi | Hehe I like this hacking attitude, I know the shogun that i own can record 60fps but untill know this was not so important.
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| 13:32 | Dan1 | Could I take 2 x 1080p30 HDMI streams, convert to SDI and record those as a combined 1080p60 signal?
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| 13:33 | Bertl | if your recorder can do that, why not
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| 13:33 | Bertl | note that our scope ends with the two 1080p30
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| 13:34 | Dan1 | I will try a test next week, reminds me of 422 + 022 down 2 x SDI for a full 444 capture from CCD like F23 and F35 and Vipers, in the day :-)
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| 13:35 | intracube | what HDMI version are the sockets on the Beta camera?
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| 13:39 | intracube | I guess probably 1.4?
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| 13:39 | intracube | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HDMI#Version_comparison
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| 13:39 | Bertl | more 1.2
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| 13:40 | Bertl | the output is limited to roughly 150Mhz pixel clock
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| 13:40 | intracube | Bertl: ah ok
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| 13:40 | Bertl | which in turn means 3x 1.5Gbit
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| 13:41 | intracube | thanks
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| 13:47 | Bertl | we can do up to three outputs at 1080p60 this way
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| 13:47 | Bertl | (although the 3xHDMI plugin module is not complete yet)
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| 13:50 | toxitobi | There is an old certificate for https://files.apertus.org/AXIOM-Beta/optimal_curve.html says firefox
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| 14:00 | intracube | Bertl: might it be possible for a later design of output module to provide either 3x HDMI @ ~v1.2 or if only one socket is in use, switch to an HDMI 1.4 mode?
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| 14:01 | intracube | or would that require other architectural changes elsewhere on the camera
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| 14:02 | Bertl | the current HDMI limit is from the Zynq, i.e. it is the maximum rate per lane which can be achieved
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| 14:03 | Bertl | switching between HDMI 1.2 and 2.0 is not easy, as it requires completely different serializers
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| 14:03 | intracube | ah ok, fair enough
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| 14:03 | Bertl | but there will be a single hdmi 2.0 plugin
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| 14:03 | intracube | oh really?
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| 14:03 | Bertl | (maybe with a second HDMI 1.0 port or so, if space permits)
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| 14:04 | Bertl | so you can switch between those plugins if needed
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| 14:04 | Bertl | toxitobi: morrigan will take care of that shortly
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| 14:04 | intracube | Bertl: that sounds great
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| 14:05 | intracube | so that could provide 4k native output on the one HDMI out
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| 14:06 | Bertl | yup
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| 14:06 | intracube | cool
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| 14:09 | intracube | Bertl: and would the 2.0 plugin be for the Gamma cam or the Beta as well?
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| 14:15 | Bertl | for the Beta
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| 14:17 | intracube | nice - thanks for the info :)
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| 16:28 | Bertl | off for a nap ... bbl
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| 18:34 | Bertl | back now ...
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| 19:10 | Alex_Chooks | Hi there ! I hope the 3d printed enclosure is useful for you ! :)
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| 19:17 | Bertl | from what I heard of it already ... definitely :)
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| 19:33 | Alex_Chooks | great !
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| 00:16 | se6astian | off to bed
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| 00:16 | se6astian | changed nick to: se6astian|away
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| 00:18 | Bertl | nn
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