01:04 | Bertl | off to bed now ... have a good one everyone!
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02:40 | doom2 | hello, i left a comment on your youtube video. I couldn't figure out how to add to the wiki sensor list, so I came here
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02:42 | doom2 | i don't have any engineering ability to execute on ideas, and i know ideas are a dime a dozen...that being said I had a few ideas, probably with poor assumptions, but i figured i'd put it out there
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02:44 | vup | doom2: I think we disabled the wiki signup because we have been getting a lot of spam recently
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02:44 | doom2 | i'm not sure competing with the sonys, reds, canons, blackmagics etc of the world in the pursuit of resolution and sharpness in apsc+ sized sensors is a high-value approach for the consumer enthusiast.
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02:45 | doom2 | i think there might be an opportunity for builders and hobbyists in between the high end 5k s35 market and the iphone/pixel market
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02:45 | doom2 | especially at a reasonable price point
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02:46 | vup | most of the team is located in EU timezones so you might not get a lot of replies at these times, but you can probably get some replies when people read up on the log in the (EU) morning
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02:46 | doom2 | like the red screen on the komodo is a joke....why not just use commodity oled cellphone screens
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02:46 | doom2 | no worries, i'm just dumping my ideas out, whether it falls on deaf ears or not is okay xD
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02:46 | vup | yeah go for it
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02:47 | vup | yeah we have been thinking about using something like cellphone screens (or for example ipad screens can also be had for relatively cheap), but the main worry there is availability
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02:47 | doom2 | there are a lot of interesting ~1/2.5" sensors coming out now at cheap prices thanks to the automotive market
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02:47 | doom2 | 120db+ dynamic range
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02:47 | doom2 | led flickering reduction
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02:48 | vup | also re smaller sensors, we have a smaller prototype that might be more suited in that direction: https://wiki.apertus.org/index.php/AXIOM_Micro
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02:49 | vup | there is a next generation of that on the way, that would gain some nice features, but the inability to buy the required chips has this kind of on the backburner
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02:50 | vup | if you have links / specific sensors you found pointers to them would be much appreciated
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02:50 | doom2 | i joined a small funding round in a cool as f startup that's built and delivered self driving hardware..and their latest iteration uses an ON AR0231AT sensor
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02:50 | doom2 | and the output from that thing is spectacular...it looks like film right out of the box
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02:51 | doom2 | only 1208 so basically 1080...but it genuinely looks like film....now one can argue you can use a cheap sony imx sensor and do a bunch of fancy tricks, and filters, and film grain on top...that might also be an avanue
| 02:53 | vup | is scrolling through the datasheet
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02:53 | doom2 | but a $5k body/brain with hardware from almost a decade ago is a very tall ask for consumers when there are already Red komodos, canon c70s, and sony's ar systems out there
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02:55 | vup | yeah I think the ar0231at is something a lot more suite to the axiom micro
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02:56 | vup | actually the sensor we are using on that one at the moment (ar0330cm) uses the same interface as the ar0231at so it would be a relatively easy swap
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02:57 | vup | one of the great things about the cmv12k is the global shutter
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02:57 | vup | which seems to be really hard to find for cheaper
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02:59 | doom2 | obviously a controversial opinion, but i'm not that sold on global shutters, or mega resolution...i think film-like dynamic range and quality of look is more important for photography and storytelling...but that's just my two cents
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03:00 | doom2 | the ar0231at has a larger sensor and larger pixel pitch than that ar0330cm it seems
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03:00 | doom2 | let me host a couple samples, only 10mbit though, i'll try to get more out of it....just started trying to learn how to program a few days ago -_-
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03:01 | doom2 | also at 20fps with variable angle shutter angle for exposure
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03:06 | doom2 | https://www.dropbox.com/s/ub6ga0uejmz9ew5/night2.mp4?dl=0
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03:07 | doom2 | keep in mind this is behind dirty automotive glass with internal reflections...only 10mbit, 20fps etc...actually it isn't well containorized...i put it into an mp4, but vlc will default to playing it at 25fps
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03:18 | vup | wow yeah that looks pretty decent
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03:20 | doom2 | i'd imagine at 30mbit something closer to bluray 1080p 264...cleaning up the compression blocks, it would looks fuckin' great
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03:22 | doom2 | zero processing, this is just logged footage from the selfdriving device...looks great right outta cam
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03:23 | doom2 | qualcomm system on modules are absurdly powerful and affordable
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03:23 | doom2 | and then you have SiFive coming out with their own 'mobile' procs very soon...so much cool potential out there, not just for cameras, but...in general
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03:25 | doom2 | https://www.dropbox.com/s/j9uo6ti13bdptkh/fog.mp4?dl=0
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03:25 | doom2 | noisey fog gradients kinda suffer from lowish bitrate, but i still think it looks fantastic
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03:26 | doom2 | anyway, something for you guys to chew on for the 'micro'
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03:27 | doom2 | i think paired with a high quality, calibrated, highly responsive (comodity priced) touchscreen OLED...there's a fantastic 'micro' opportunity
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03:31 | doom2 | and with the quallcomm brain, running on android, there are so many already built copy-paste, drag and and drop solutions for building the software
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03:31 | doom2 | *'well built*
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03:31 | doom2 | and opensource :p
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03:55 | doom2 | that's my desire though... A contax T3 or sony rx100 size, cinematic-quality, 1080p pocket shooter :PPP
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04:00 | doom2 | i think the ultimate question for a proposed open source pocket-cine-cam is...whether to use an expensive automotive/industrial sensor like the ON that gets things done with minimal post code, or a cheap sony high resolution IMX sensor and code look and features on top
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04:04 | doom2 | the rational answer is probably Sony IMX + post processing and film-grain rendered on top....but the irrational brain wants the physicality of the natural look of the automotive sensors xD
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04:05 | doom2 | well...'natural'
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04:05 | doom2 | anyway, good nights, thanks for listening to my self-indulgent rambles
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04:05 | doom2 | best of luck!
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08:43 | se6astian | good day
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13:40 | Bertl_zZ | changed nick to: Bertl
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13:40 | Bertl | morning folks!
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15:22 | se6astian | felix_: every glas layer will influence the other layers, depending on filters having anti reflective coating the effect can be reduced
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16:20 | felix_ | the anti-reflective coating should improve things; thanks for the pointer
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16:54 | se6astian | "Anti-reflective coatings are often used in camera lenses, giving lens elements distinctive colours."
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16:54 | se6astian | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-reflective_coating
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16:55 | se6astian | while the glass itself has not really seen much innovation in the last decades a lot happened with the coatings
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16:59 | se6astian | doom2, in case you read this in the logs
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16:59 | se6astian | many thanks for your input and thoughts
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17:00 | se6astian | actually the apertus project started with exactly what you describe
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17:00 | se6astian | modifying the Elphel 353 camera with a 5 Mpixel 1/2.5" CMOS that provided pretty decent resolution/colors and look
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17:02 | se6astian | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elphel
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17:05 | se6astian | it had very similar aesthetics as what you are showing
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17:05 | se6astian | https://vimeo.com/28615648
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17:10 | se6astian | https://www.apertus.org/fr/en/elphelcamera
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17:11 | se6astian | the memories :)
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