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#apertus IRC Channel Logs

2014/11/02

Timezone: UTC


23:15
comradekingu
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00:18
pizthewiz
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00:20
Bertl
off to bed now ... have a good one everyone!
00:20
Bertl
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pizthewiz
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intracube
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g3gg0
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08:22
se6astian|away
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08:23
se6astian
good morning
08:28
lab-bot
sebastian created T112: Standard icons for apertus.org project pages to github and wiki. http://lab.apertus.org/T112
08:58
lab-bot
sebastian created T113: CMV12000 PCB module pogress. http://lab.apertus.org/T113
08:58
lab-bot
sebastian created T114: Remote Control Simulator draft. http://lab.apertus.org/T114
09:02
se6astian
updated wishlist table
09:02
se6astian
https://www.apertus.org/en/dictator
09:03
se6astian
gotta go
09:03
se6astian
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aombk2
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PhilCee
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12:51
Bertl_zZ
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12:51
Bertl
morning folks!
12:58
lab-bot
davidak created T115: Breadcrumb Links don't work. http://lab.apertus.org/T115
13:30
PhilCee
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Juicyfruit
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Juiceman42
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bassam__
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intracube_
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17:34
se6astian|away
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wescotte
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17:37
se6astian
good evening
17:38
intracube
evening se6astian
17:44
Bertl
evening!
18:22
philippej
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19:00
Bertl
hey philippej!
19:03
philippej
Hello Bertl :-)
19:04
lab-bot
Bertl created T118: Check-in CMOSIS Datasheets to the Beta Repository. http://lab.apertus.org/T118
19:16
FergusL
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FergusL
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19:26
lab-bot
sebastian closed T118: Check-in CMOSIS Datasheets to the Beta Repository as "Resolved". http://lab.apertus.org/T118
19:52
lab-bot
philippej closed T86: can we change the default applications in phabricator left hand menu? as "Wontfix". http://lab.apertus.org/T86
19:52
philippej
can anyone tell my what "spite" mean in the realm of bug / task status ?
19:54
troy_s
philippej: I suspect it is the sarcastic nature of Phabricator
19:55
troy_s
philippej: â So, I think features like these actually make the software better, which is why you can close tasks "Out of Spite" in Maniphest and the submit button in Differential is labeled "Clowncopterize". Plus, they're fun to build.â
19:55
philippej
looks for the translation of out of spite
19:56
philippej
I see
19:56
troy_s
philippej: I believe that particular one is malicious closure
19:56
troy_s
As in if you kept bothering me about something and I tried to make my case but you kept at it
19:56
troy_s
Out of Spite would be a good reason
19:56
philippej
:-)
19:56
troy_s
It is close to a wontfix I would think
19:56
troy_s
But more edged.
19:56
philippej
we could create some additional status if needed btw
19:57
troy_s
I think it is hilarious
19:57
troy_s
It is a Linus Torvalds closure tag really. :)
19:57
troy_s
Without the f-bombs
19:57
philippej
I guess it's stuff like that that got me instantly hooked to phabricator
19:57
troy_s
(Although I could see a closure due to a nasty hard-to-find bug being spiteful too.
19:57
troy_s
Yep
19:57
philippej
this and the fact that it's particularly well written and thought
19:58
troy_s
philippej: â Thanks to Phabricator I can close the guy everyone hates' issues out of spite.â
19:58
philippej
on install, it gives you advice on everything, like "the size of your mysql cache is a bit too small", etc ...
19:58
philippej
haha
19:59
troy_s
â deliberately hurt, annoy, or offend (someone).â
19:59
troy_s
That is the definition of spite from Google's top search.
19:59
troy_s
Hopefully that translates better for you.
20:00
philippej
perfectly, thanks
20:00
troy_s
Breadcrumb links not working philippej ?
20:01
philippej
breadcrumb are tricky in drupal ...
20:01
Bertl
troy_s: I think they should work, but I haven't seen any labels for that in the source of the pages
20:01
troy_s
The hash tag one works here.
20:01
philippej
you have at least 10 add on modules to manage
20:01
troy_s
The one without doesn't.
20:02
philippej
if a page is part of the menu the breadcrumb will show
20:02
troy_s
I just saw the Phab bug
20:02
philippej
else it won't
20:02
troy_s
Bertl: Back to the dungeon you!
20:02
philippej
what would be a decent behavior, that's the question
20:02
troy_s
J'adore Phabricator.
20:03
troy_s
This is slick http://files.apertus.org/controller-simulator/
20:04
philippej
ça rime en plus -> it rhymes :-)
20:04
troy_s
Sony's is extremely well designed graphically speaking.
20:05
FergusL
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FergusL
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lab-bot
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lab-bot
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20:09
philippej
lab bot will now be a little bit more verbose, it's an experiment, let me know if the guy talks too much
20:10
Bertl
lab-bot: what's up pal?
20:11
philippej
unfortunately it's still as dumb as before
20:11
philippej
but it will notify some more tasks status changes
20:32
FergusL
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20:33
FergusL
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20:33
lab-bot
philippej closed T30: apertus.org: email notification for comment publish as "Resolved". http://lab.apertus.org/T30
20:44
troy_s
On MOX http://major-kong.blogspot.co.uk/2014/10/a-mox-on-both-your-house-formats.html
20:44
troy_s
(That is by a Foundry developer who worked on Nuke of course)
20:47
lab-bot
sebastian reopened T30: apertus.org: email notification for comment publish as "Open". http://lab.apertus.org/T30
21:07
lab-bot
philippej claimed T112: Standard icons for apertus.org project pages to github and wiki. http://lab.apertus.org/T112
21:19
philippej
About MOX, I see the need for some kind of pdf-x for image sequences (fail- and idiot- proof, reduced feature set from a more general purpose format)
21:19
philippej
very interesting to see where it ends up
21:20
troy_s
philippej: I worry that MOX has too much of a myopic view on Adobe products. ICCs etc.
21:20
troy_s
Really awful idea(TM)
21:21
troy_s
philippej: Your suggestion is a good point, but at that very point you make an ideological judgment on who / what is your target. To optimize for that will ostracize the other designed targets.
21:21
troy_s
philippej: It speaks volumes that he got the idea from the After Effects forum.
21:22
philippej
I'm not taking the pdf/x example because it as created by adobe, but more for it's "less is more" philosophy that works extremely well.
21:22
troy_s
philippej: Whereas Bink's commentary is from the highest end of imaging, and if the high end doesn't adopt it, it's as good as dead.
21:22
troy_s
Less is never more.
21:22
troy_s
Less is always less.
21:22
troy_s
Fsck Mies Van Der Rohe
21:22
philippej
bring an interactive pdf to the print shop :-)
21:23
troy_s
(Uniquely Industrial-Modernist. :) )
21:23
troy_s
PDFs go to the print shop all the time, but not because they are reduced.
21:23
philippej
then let's say, reducing features sometimes ease of communication between parties
21:23
troy_s
Rather they tend to target the lowest common denominator.
21:23
troy_s
Sure. And I totally agree.
21:23
troy_s
The problem is your implied "parties" there.
21:24
troy_s
Everyone (much like Apertus) is going to have an opinion. The challenging question is who do you listen to?
21:24
troy_s
(Depends on goals of course, but a minor design decision can have rather massive implications. For example, if Brendan goes with ICC, there is a less than zero percentage chance that any post house anywhere will touch the format. It is a still-born.)
21:25
troy_s
And if you implement OCIO, you gain them and alienate the Adobe users he is appeasing.
21:25
troy_s
So... no easy solution there. And certainly _zero_ chance of a solution that works for both without violating your design tenet of reductionism.
21:25
troy_s
philippej: Sense?
21:25
philippej
yes
21:26
philippej
seems that pdf/x worked because it was a consortium of companies
21:26
troy_s
I don't pretend to have an answer there. Personally, I loathe After Effects.
21:26
troy_s
PDF 1.4 is everything I've ever had to take to an offset with.
21:26
troy_s
Not X.
21:26
philippej
that or because adobe won almost all the printed media tools
21:26
troy_s
And I'm pretty certain that a vast bulk of print shops probably request 1.4 support.
21:26
troy_s
Why did they win?
21:27
troy_s
:)
21:27
philippej
pdf/x is a subset of 1.4 as far as I understand it
21:27
troy_s
The answer ties directly into this discussion. They won because they focused on graphic design.
21:27
troy_s
Hence ICCs etc.
21:27
philippej
I think partly because at some point, you could reliably bring a pdf file from indesign and be sure it would print correctly
21:27
troy_s
The issue is that when they branched out into motion picture stuffs, they chose ecosystem compatibilty as a design goal and thereby crippled all of photographic imagin henceforth.
21:28
troy_s
(Photoshop and After Effects are _deeply_ entrenched in graphic design legacy decisions.)
21:28
troy_s
Sucks entirely for photography work at this juncture, yet not too many can see why.
21:29
troy_s
I mean it doesn't take a rocket surgeon to see their blend modes and go "Uh... WTF". Linear blend for example, is a sort of a hackey workaround for the fact that their entire subsystem is designed around display referred imaging with non-linear at the core.
21:29
troy_s
(All legacy reasons.)
21:36
__anton__
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21:37
__anton__
troy_s: hi there, reading with great interest :) is there a photo-image handling software that you like (replacing Photoshop?)
21:38
lab-bot
sebastian created T119: clear boost cache of a particular page when a page has been altered in drupal. http://lab.apertus.org/T119
21:38
troy_s
__anton__: I'm probably worthy to ignore. But the question is moored in context and to appreciate why I made the statement, you sort of have to unwind all of the implicit crap that folks speak of without stating.
21:38
philippej
tbh I have no big hope for the adoption of a file format by the industry. Seems like it goes all the time in the other direction (more formats, more obsolescence, more "jails")
21:39
troy_s
philippej: The "industry" are the folks in most need of interchange. A file format wrapper isn't the most ideal ever, but that takes a little bit of understanding to see why. You simply are never dealing with codecs nor kitchen sink apps.
21:39
troy_s
__anton__: You are familiar with imaging basics I take it?
21:39
__anton__
troy_s: I can probably ignored here as well, I'm a java programmer at a bank :) Yet I'm interested to hear if there's specifically a photo-image handling piece of software that works with screne-referred intensities
21:40
philippej
troy_s, do you include camera makers in the industry ?
21:40
jucar
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21:40
__anton__
troy_s: I'm pretty naive, yet I flatter myself thinking I understand what you're talking about
21:41
troy_s
__anton__: Do you have an image editor handy?
21:41
__anton__
GIMP :)
21:41
troy_s
Perfect.
21:41
troy_s
Open it.
21:41
troy_s
Create a canvas. Fill it with a value of neutral grey of say 55 on a 255 8 bit scale.
21:41
lab-bot
philippej created T120: Provide better multicolumn and layout tools in drupal. http://lab.apertus.org/T120
21:42
troy_s
__anton__: Let me know when you have done this.
21:43
__anton__
troy_s: done
21:43
troy_s
Make a fuzzy brush.
21:43
troy_s
A large one.
21:43
troy_s
Set R and B to full for a magenta
21:43
troy_s
Do three or four strokes.
21:44
troy_s
In a row like roman numerals.
21:44
troy_s
Done?
21:45
troy_s
(Must be a fuzzy brush of course.)
21:45
__anton__
yup
21:45
troy_s
Now take a full green stroke and cross through all of them. Finally, take a full yellow stroke and also cross through them.
21:45
troy_s
So you have a picket fence basically
21:45
troy_s
Purple slats, full green and full yellow intensity cross beams.
21:46
lab-bot
sebastian created T121: find/build a method to publish individual news on different social media/newsletter/websites. http://lab.apertus.org/T121
21:46
__anton__
got a fence :)
21:46
troy_s
Notice anything odd?
21:46
troy_s
In particular, around the edges of the blurry strokes?
21:47
troy_s
(To really make the final case, a full cyan (G + B) will reveal the issue across the purple.)
21:47
__anton__
i see that my horizontal sausages got squeezed when they cross the vertical bars
21:47
troy_s
That isn't squeezing.
21:48
troy_s
If you look closely, you will see a distinct fringing around the purple.
21:48
troy_s
Black smokey fringing.
21:48
troy_s
Yes?
21:48
__anton__
purple eats into yellow and green?
21:49
troy_s
You should see it with the saturated magenta crossing the grey, the green crossing the magenta, and the cyan.
21:49
troy_s
It doesn't eat.
21:49
troy_s
That's the result of a non-linear blend.
21:49
troy_s
Basically, when we ship colors to a display (LDR) we have to bend the intensities so they look what we expect in our HDR reality.
21:50
troy_s
That bending results in nasty ass bad math because the math being done is _not_ based on any sort of real-world physics, which we define as our baseline of "correct".
21:50
troy_s
So that fringing is because you are painting in a display referred model using non-linear color models.
21:50
__anton__
yes smth about gamma I guess
21:50
__anton__
so is there a tool for handling photos that uses linear?
21:50
troy_s
Indeed. Gamma is a uniform curve. A better term is transfer curve or tone response curve because not all non-linear curves are uniform. Some are a couple of formulas, some are more.
21:51
troy_s
Well the next bit of logic is
21:51
troy_s
"Ok I get it... we need linear (or to be more precise, radiometrically linear ratios) of data values to imitate the real world."
21:51
troy_s
Agree with that sort of basic explanation?
21:51
__anton__
yes
21:51
troy_s
Now take your DSLR
21:51
troy_s
What kind do you have?
21:51
__anton__
Nikon D40, Panasonic GH3
21:51
troy_s
Great.
21:52
troy_s
When you set it to JPEG, it mangles up the data it captures and spits out a display referred image from zero to one (or more specifically, 0-255 for an 8 bit image)
21:52
troy_s
It is _curved_
21:52
troy_s
and the ranges are fixed from minimum to maximum.
21:52
troy_s
But as you know, your D40, even though it isn't the uber super camera you could buy if you wanted to
21:52
troy_s
has... pretty damn good latitude. Agree?
21:53
troy_s
It can probably capture a decent six or seven stops above a middle grey card shot.
21:53
troy_s
Agree?
21:53
__anton__
Yes, sounds about right
21:53
troy_s
In data now... If we expose such that a middle grey 18% reflectance card comes up at around say, middle of a JPEGs value set.
21:54
troy_s
It would be 120-124 ish
21:54
troy_s
If we _linearize_ it by flipping the sRGB curve around
21:54
troy_s
That value ends up at 0.2
21:54
troy_s
Or so.
21:54
troy_s
With me so far?
21:54
troy_s
Or did I lose you in the rabbit hole?
21:54
__anton__
yeah, I started looking into this recently when you spoke of OpenEXR, I think I get it
21:54
troy_s
Good.
21:54
troy_s
Case problem 1:
21:54
troy_s
Our JPEG can hold how many stops of data?
21:55
troy_s
0.2 + 0.2 = 0.4
21:55
troy_s
1 stop
21:55
lab-bot
philippej updated subscribers of T121: find/build a method to publish individual news on different social media/newsletter/websites. http://lab.apertus.org/T121
21:55
troy_s
0.4+0.4 = 0.8 two stops
21:55
troy_s
Only two and a bit stops!
21:55
troy_s
The camera has to take that massive dynamic range and bend it _really_ quite badly to cram it into a display referred jpeg.
21:55
troy_s
And we can't really get that data back because we only have the jpeg linearization to invert.
21:55
troy_s
If we take a raw data file
21:56
philippej
troy_s it would be really great to have articles on what you often explain here
21:56
troy_s
the values have a maximum and a minimum still, but we could, if we wanted, take the values and (because sensors are damn close to linear) dump them into an imaging editor.
21:56
troy_s
If we load them in GIMP, we are still stuck in display referred land - 0 to 1.
21:57
philippej
(I mean if someone could summarize this :-) )
21:57
troy_s
But as we saw in the GIMP demo, we _must_ have linearized values in order to do an over correctly.
21:57
troy_s
So if your Nikon D40 has say, six stops above middle grey
21:57
troy_s
and we map middle grey to 0.2
21:57
lab-bot
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lab-bot
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21:57
troy_s
.2, .4, .8, 1.6, 3.2, 6.4, 12.8
21:58
philippej
good night everyone !
21:58
troy_s
Enter scene referred imaging.
21:58
troy_s
__anton__: Does that make the issue any clearer?
21:58
troy_s
In such an application you'd need to specifically control several things:
21:58
__anton__
Thanks, Troy, that's a very accessible explanation
21:58
troy_s
1) What is the curve of the input image? There are an infinite number. The app needs to let you set the inversion correctly.
21:59
philippej
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22:00
troy_s
2) Such an app would need to have a mapping for white and black points. Arbitrarily high values and lower ones to the display referred domain. That is, we have to creatively control how we transform from the scene referred domain to the display referred.
22:00
troy_s
But all of that crap I just sort of rolled through extremely swiftly, takes a bit of reasoning as to _why_ you need to control those things.
22:00
__anton__
that's still great to read it
22:00
troy_s
And that isn't easily accessible to everyone, worse if you are only used to Photoshop or some other graphic-design centric application.
22:01
__anton__
and it matches well with what you spoke about earlier
22:01
troy_s
Have you ever used an NLE app and done a dissolve?
22:01
troy_s
Probably right?
22:01
troy_s
Now ask yourself how those values were blended.
22:01
troy_s
Chances are they used the curved, non-linear values in the image carrier format, and guess what...
22:01
troy_s
that dissolve is as broken as your magenta over grey
22:01
__anton__
:)
22:02
troy_s
Hence the idea of a video dissovle versus say, a film dissolve (or more accurately, a nonlinear blend versus a more correct radiometrically linear blend.)
22:02
troy_s
Interesting stuff if you are into imaging for certain. Not so much if you aren't.
22:02
troy_s
:)
22:02
__anton__
I understand there are decent tools out there that work with video using scene referred imaging
22:02
__anton__
What about photo?
22:02
troy_s
Yep.
22:03
troy_s
Very very very very very few to the best of my knowledge.
22:03
troy_s
Because A) most folks are used to things like Photoshop, and when you say something like 'scene referred' their head spins.
22:03
troy_s
B) the above "simple" explanation takes quite a bit of grounding foundation.
22:03
troy_s
C) Many folks are used to Aperture or Lightroom
22:03
troy_s
Which are specifically, processing tools.
22:04
troy_s
When processing, the model is more than often smart to use a display referred form.
22:04
troy_s
Which opens up a huge can of worms
22:04
troy_s
As in ... can we mix and match our models of scene versus display?
22:04
troy_s
What happens if we do?
22:04
troy_s
Or do we divide the manipulations further into two classes:
22:04
troy_s
A) Image manipulation / blending / over / etc.
22:04
troy_s
B) Color Manipulation / grading.
22:05
troy_s
and suddenly it begins to make sense as to why you never grade mid pipeline, but rather only at the very very end.
22:05
Bertl
even blending or resizing doesn't give correct results if the space is nonlinear (unless the blending math corrects for it)
22:06
troy_s
Bingo.
22:06
troy_s
Nor blurs.
22:06
troy_s
Anything with interpolation.
22:06
troy_s
Because the interpolation requires a _traversal_ across a tri-color model.
22:06
troy_s
And anything that requires traversal is utterly going to be broken in a non-linear format.
22:06
troy_s
__anton__: Kind of interesting stuff eh?
22:06
troy_s
__anton__: Here's a cool question...
22:07
troy_s
Think of a dissolve briefly.
22:07
troy_s
Now visualize making a dissolve that runs a diagonal line from top to bottom ... a dissolve down to another strip.
22:07
troy_s
Being a LINEAR line, we can immediately say "Wait a minute... that means it is a perceptual linear because at 50% of the line we expect 50% of our display referred perceptual value to be about half intensity"
22:08
troy_s
So how the hell do you do a dissolve using that sort of GUI element?
22:08
troy_s
If you _linearize_ the data, 50% along the line will have a dissolve that isn't perceptual at all, but rather quite a bit brighter at 50%.
22:08
lab-bot
Rebelj12a created T122: Reorganization. http://lab.apertus.org/T122
22:08
troy_s
Yet we _must_ have linearized data to do the dissolve 'correctly'.
22:08
troy_s
:)
22:09
troy_s
(Hint: You have to effectively bend the time curve)
22:09
troy_s
If you have a linear diagonal time curve, you have to bend that in accordance with your non-linear output.
22:10
g3gg0
left the channel
22:10
troy_s
And likewise, gradients are challenging as hell. If you traverse from red to green, you ideally have to do that on a linear model in order to get correct blending, but if you go from dark red to say bright green, you have to deal with the color traversal (the red to the green) in isolation from the intensity traversal (dark to light)
22:10
troy_s
Plenty of interesting stuff.
22:10
lab-bot
Rebelj12a created T123: Add section or page for Open Source Arduino. http://lab.apertus.org/T123
22:13
__anton__
heh, took me a while to take it in :) so time-curve is going to be different for each pixel in dissolve?
22:17
Rebelj12a
joined the channel
22:17
Rebelj12a
*dying* ... ... ... slowly
22:18
troy_s
Rebelj12a: LOL
22:19
troy_s
__anton__: Just think of a time line diagonal being perceptual. That is, at 0.5 distance, you expect it to be about 50% perceptual. The way to get a curve back to the linear values is via an inverted curve transform. So in the case of sRGB, 0.5 ends up around 0.2
22:19
Rebelj12a
Usually the day after a shoot isn't the worst, its the 2nd day after that kills me. However today.. its really bad for some reason. Might be because my arm actually physically gave out last night. Might have pushed too hard.
22:20
troy_s
__anton__: Make sense?
22:20
__anton__
troy_s: yes, it does. Indeed very interesting :)
22:20
troy_s
__anton__: So a conforming solution would need to take the spline curves and figure out if they are perceptual or curved, and interpret accordingly.
22:20
Rebelj12a
Troy is full of fantastically interesting and informative information on color, gamma and curves.
22:21
troy_s
LOL. I wish.
22:21
troy_s
Just a few years of making mistakes.
22:21
troy_s
And doing the old "Good god that looks like ass. What the hell is going on?"
22:22
troy_s
__anton__: A gradient is an identical dilemma that forces us to examine the two halves of color: Chromaticity (the hue or color of a color) and Luminance (the intensity of the color)
22:23
troy_s
__anton__: Little factoids come to light that are often overlooked when you are happily painting in Photoshop or something, such as ... The base color red you are looking at _never_ changes in an RGB system. It is the _same_ color red from 0.000000000001 to 1.0.
22:24
__anton__
there was a time when I wondered why anybody would need anything apart from RGB triplets at all. Hue? Who needs a hue? :-)
22:24
troy_s
Rebelj12a: When you logging on it?
22:24
se6astian
new article released
22:24
se6astian
https://apertus.org/axiom-beta-progress-article-november-2014
22:24
se6astian
time for bed now
22:24
se6astian
good night!
22:24
se6astian
changed nick to: se6astian|away
22:24
Rebelj12a
night sebastian
22:26
Rebelj12a
The online simulation remote controller structure. Would that be for use on a smartphone? Or properietary touch screen remote?
22:27
troy_s
http://assets.pro.sony.eu/Web/menu-simulator/index.html
22:30
Rebelj12a
No no i mean the end product remote
22:31
Rebelj12a
Android app, ios app, or proprietary remote/open source remote
22:31
Rebelj12a
Basically, I want to know what kind of hardware interface screen im working with first before making suggestions.
22:32
troy_s
Rebelj12a: I suspect that is going to be the menu on the side of the camera.
22:32
troy_s
There was a thing already broken down on the wiki with some elements
22:32
troy_s
(Like the CC axis (CDL / LUTs per view / eyepiece /etc.)
22:33
Rebelj12a
ah ok, ill check the wiki. Yes i know how the remote system and simulators work, ive played with the arri
22:33
Rebelj12a
i.e. pushed shiny buttons
22:34
Rebelj12a
No no i meant in the progress article sebastion just posted. Theres the Axiom Beta Controller Menu Simulator. The Axiom Beta Controller will it be ios, android, or open source / proprietary.
22:34
Rebelj12a
If so what hardware.
22:35
Bertl
most likely it will be PIC32MZ based, with an SPI attached LCD and a bunch of buttons/dials
22:35
Bertl
think arduino, just microchip instead of atmel
22:36
Rebelj12a
Ok will the screen support multitouch?
22:36
Bertl
unlikely
22:36
Rebelj12a
too bad ok then
22:36
Bertl
most likely it will not support touch at all, thus the buttons
22:36
troy_s
Does it need multitouch?
22:37
troy_s
Thank god.
22:37
Rebelj12a
oh buttons ok
22:37
troy_s
Rebelj12a: You ought to be anti-touch too having that blasted BMCC.
22:37
Rebelj12a
It mentioned remote so
22:37
Rebelj12a
I am, however, on a remote such as an android app.
22:37
troy_s
Sure.
22:37
Rebelj12a
Multitouch is 10x better. especially being that small
22:37
Rebelj12a
on the camera itself, its the devil
22:37
Bertl
yes, the android app will use touch of course :)
22:37
Rebelj12a
Ah ok ^_^
22:38
Bertl
but it will, similar to the simulator, make it look like buttons :)
22:38
Bertl
(at least that's what I understood :)
22:39
Rebelj12a
So, taking design suggestions on it?
22:40
troy_s
ala http://assets.pro.sony.eu/Web/menu-simulator/index.html
22:41
troy_s
and http://www.arri.de/camera/alexa/tools/alexa_camera_simulator.html
22:42
Rebelj12a
my favorite the alexa
22:42
Rebelj12a
er Arri
22:44
Rebelj12a
That wheel mmm
22:48
Rebelj12a
Bertl is there a list of percieved functions that are going to be in the release OS for Beta? Oh wait ill check the wiki
22:49
Bertl
probably nothing fixed yet, too early
22:50
Rebelj12a
Ah ok, in designing the menu its helpful to know the general layout and functions that are needed.
22:52
Bertl
but do not limit yourself by planned features, we will sooner or later get all features which make sense
22:52
Bertl
(and a few more which don't :)
22:53
Rebelj12a
Well yes, menu design and feature design go hand in hand with fixed buttons and the like. Ah ill just plan design for future easier that way.